Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000
From: "clement chui"
Dear Jim and Kam Wah,
Now that our web has 100 Mbs of capacity and 100 email accounts it's time to consider a scheme of "Friends of Kamching" -------accept application from our friends to be friends of kamching and assign them an email account and personal web directory so as to make full use of our facility. I'll design an application form on our web. Those who would like to join has to fill in the form, pending our approval.
The data we require could include: name, address, email address, self introduction, frequency of using the Internet, main content of personal web directory, introduced by which kamching member etc.
If each one of us can introduce 2 friends then we could increase our users to around 50.
What's your opinion?
Man Keung
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From: Charles Lam
Date: September 04, 2000
Subject: Re: friends of kamching
Dear Man Keung,
It is good to have more friends who have or support Kamching spirit, not those who want to share our facilities only.
As discussed earlier, if personal websites embraced by Kamching.com are allowed, some code of conduct is needed. The challenge is: how to ensure/control web-based business and communications linked to Kamching.com will be healthy and ethical. An argument is: we can trust the Kamching member who makes the introduction.
Another question is: what fees to collect for using our facilities?
Also, once the application form is on the web, we have to be ready to answer questions about mission and future action plans. Genuine applicants shall ask them.
Regards,
Charles
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Date: 5 Sept 00
From: Man Keung
Subject: Conclude the Kamching chapter gloriously
Dear Kam Wah,
Thanks for your comment on the idea of Friends of Kamching.
Before we agree on any scheme, let's assess the present situation.
How many kamching brothers have we established connection with?
Out of the 13 people on our email list, how many are active?
How many are likely to be included in our correspondence and
become active?
Let us face the reality: there is no Kamching Association after
the death of Chiu sir.
No more future action plan other than the memorial walk, the
social gathering and
the Cyber presence.
What we are doing is trying to conclude the Kamching chapter
gloriously. The good
old Kamching days have become history. Yet, let the tale and
spirit of kamching pass
on, at least in Cyberspace.
We'll have to build an archive or library of kamching events.
That's our main concern.
But that wouldn't attract any hits to our web site. So I think
it's worthwhile to invite
some of our friends who are professionals in a certain field
to use our web facility,
host their web pages and develop content. I have a few names
in my mind who are
mostly teachers or ex-teachers in various subjects.
May be we should only invite our friends rather than open to
the public. In that case we
can be sure that our web would not be used to host any unhealthy
content.
I don't mind if our friends use their expertise to do business
on their personal web sites,
as long as they maintain a balanced content and are different
from commercial sites.
As for sharing the expense of web hosting, we still have to think out a plan.
We Sydney Four will have dinner tonight and will discuss on the
itinery of Ka Kui and
the idea of Friends of Kamching.
Best regards,
Man Keung
* I still haven't received Ka Yun's article.
--------------------------------------------------------
Date: 5 Sept 00
From: Charles
Subject: conclude the Kamching chapter gloriously
Dear Man Keung,
If you think that I want to keep the old people only and bar
new friends to join
Kamching, you are wrong.
And if you think that I want to continue with the old KCA activities
only, you are also
wrong.
I agree only partially that "...there is no Kamching Association
after the death of Chiu sir."
Although we will not run KCA activities like before, we can
conduct new ones following the
Kamching spirit. Surely individual websites can have their own
action plans--history
research and courses (you), information society sharing (me),
and other ones in different
fields which benefit the society. There can also be joint action
plans in the future, if we
use our imagination.
Let's concern less about the hits at this moment. We do not intend
to get advertising
revenue or want to attract acquisition by a rich company, do
we? If not, let's concern
more on the purpose of the Kamching.com i.e. what is it for?
In my opinion, the most important objective, at this stage at
least, is to facilitate
communications and mutual learning. Therefore friends of Kamching,
old and new, can
learn from each others' philosophies and experiences about a
lot of things linked to the
Kamching spirit--hiking, canoeing, rock climbing, walking....writing,
reading, web
surfing,....appreciating the nature, music, painting, planting,....education,
life-time learning,
self-development....enhancing relationships in the family.....
However, for allowing business to be done through websites embraced
by
Kamching.com, more thoughts are needed, considering:
-natures of business--e.g. what if a member begins a new web
business which conflicts
with the kamching spirit
-sharing of costs and risks--e.g. if a transaction fails due
to web problems
-legal responsibility--e.g. what if a site is being sued because
of copyright infringement?
-etc.
Worldwide cases about dotcom collapses and law infringements
deserve our attention
before making such decision."....as long as they maintain a
balanced content and are
different from commercial sites." seem a bit vague to me.
Of course, we trust that friends of the old Kamching friends
would respect Chiu Sir and
Kamching and therefore would not pollute Kamching.com. Issuing
a code of conduct
from the start can avoid (at least minimise) misunderstanding
and possible conflicts in the
future. This is an action of mutual respect, not distrust.
Hope the above can be good food for thought, as you dine together,
regards,
Charles
-----------------------------------
Date: 5 Sept 00
From: clement chui
Subject: business or no business
Dear Kam Wah,
Let me summarise your opinions as follows:
1. objectives of KCA web: communication and mutual learning
eg philosophies and experiences;
2. we can still conduct new KCA activities on the web like you
and I;
3. never mind the hits of our web;
4. worries about using our web for business eg transaction dispute
and copyright dispute;
5. a set of code of conducts needed.
My response are as follows:
1 & 2: I agree. That's what we've been doing or targetting. The problem is who else other than you, Jim and I? It takes time, it depends on the habit of writing, and it requires more if we are going to discuss philosophies and experiences. Other members are either very busy with their work or do not have the habit of writing.
3: yes, I don't mind the hits. I am just thinking of a way of promoting the name of kamching and using the facilities, at least to our friends.
4: yes, there should be no download of stuff like mp3 and no hard selling of one's commercial product. As for e-commerce, it's just a tool that facilitates business. It needs special arrangement and is not ready on our web anyway.
Actually what we are talking is "small business" which In Australia is just another term of self-employment. For most people, you are either being employed, self employed or unemployed.
It's obvious that the KCA web is not for anyone's business. ( The tragedy of Chiu sir is: others think that he's been doing big business under the name of kamching.)
What I mean by "balanced content" is that the business section should be at least of the same weight as it's education and community content.
For example, you are allowed in your web site to sell your teaching package to those readers who want to know more since the main purpose of your web is not business and your web contribute a lot to the community. It's resonable to charge the reader who are willing to pay for your value-added service.
I did consider turning the main portion of the KCA web into my dreamed-of web learning project but it's still a long way off and it's not practical commercially. Also, Dollarhost uses the unix operating system and does not support Windows technology of which I might need for a simple to use database program.
5: I agree. We need to draft a set of conduct codes from the start.
Will keep you informed of tonight's discussion.
Man Keung
ps What happened to Leung Bun? It seems that he's disappeared!
-----------------------------------
Date: 5 Sept 00
From: Jim
Subject: business or no business
Dear Man Keung and Charles,
The provision of free e-mail account and web-page is not new
on the Internet as many
companies have done it quite successfully. What we are
trying to do is broaden the
exposure of kamching.com and involve as many people as possible.
There have to be
safeguards and standards (line needs to be drawn on pornographic
and racial materials),
otherwise we should not try to censor the contents to be published
on the web. I feel
conducting commercial activities on the web is ok as it is an
inevitable development. If we
can assist our Kamching brothers and friends to prosper in their
businesses, it will be
fantastic. Our target would be the novice users anyway
as the more experienced users will
have their means to put up a web site themselves and our services
will not be required or
sufficient.
The expenses of maintaining kamching.com is minimal and I would
encourage both of you to
make the best of it for our mutual benefits. What we need
is a concerted effort to move
forward with kamching.com. Perhaps a strategic plan followed
by an operational plan would
help.
My time to head up the effort would be limited but I would be
willing to contribute to the
discussions and provide whatever support required to move forward.
Best regards,
Jim
Vancouver
----------------------
Date: 5 Sept 00
From: Charles
Subject: business or no business
Charles Lam wrote:
Dear Jim and Man Keung,
I agree to Jim's view concerning:
-free email accounts and web space
-safeguards and standards (in line with our idea of code of
conduct)
-no censorship of contents (but we reserve the right to erase
contents that go off the
track)
-supporting users with less experiences
-concerted efforts; strategic plan followed by an operational
plan
regards,
Charles
----------------------
Date: 7 Sept 00
From: Man Keung
Subject: usage of KCA web
Dear Kam Wah and Jim,
I talked to Bobby and Chris on Tuesday night and talked to Kam Hung this morning about the usage of KCA web.Their opinions are as follows:
1. They agree generally to encourage KCA members and friends to use our web facilities.
2. They thought that it would be great if Kam Wah and I or other members could make use of the web and generate some income.
3. The facilities could be offered free but if anyone of us make use of the KCA web to promote his business then it's fair enough for this member to contribute to the cost of web hosting and other expenses. That would be the most favoured way of paying for the cost of KCA web.
4. They have trust in us or those friends introduced by us to abide by the general code of conduct on the Internet. Yet a set of conduct codes could be drafted and sent as attachment with the notification. I've created a web directory for Corinna ( www.kamching.com/~corinna ) to test her web pages before they are uploaded to the server of hkedcity.net.
Corinna has formed a company called Elite Education Centre focusing on providing content for web learning for HK students. It would be great if we could build our web to offer online learning too.
Regards,Man Keung
------------------------------------
Subject: usage of KCA web
Date: 07 Sep 2000
From: Charles Lam
Dear Man Keung,
I am glad that we have achieved consensus on the most important issues.
I am interested in learning more about services offered by Elite Education Centre. But currently I can see one page only.
Things I hope to see next are:
-counters at Kamching.com homepage and individual websites
-mission statement /strategic plan of Kamching
-your personal website
There can be many versions of online learning. Which one do you mean?
Best regards,
Charles
----------------------------------------
From: Man Keung
Date: 8 Sept 00
Subject: usage of the KCA web
Dear Kam Wah,
(1) About Elite Education Center:
Corinna is the content provider in the field of web learning. She is the middle person between the authors and the network provider. Her product will be put on the SMILE program of Poly U and also the ihouse of hkedcity.net.
At present she focuses on providing MC questions for the SMILE program . The program is very strong in database management but difficult and boring to use. There's a lot of things to do and the award is not guaranteed.
I've just uploaded all content given by Corinna to her personal directory at www.kamching.com/~corinna. The site will be modified in the next few days.
The site of the Education dept is at www.hkedcity.net
The ihouse (web directories provided for promoting web learning)
section will be open in November. May be you are interested in registering
as a member or partner.
(2) Web counters will be implemented shortly.
(3) I aim at user paid online learning. Users need to suscribe ( by cheques, pay into bank account etc) and log in using password. That's why we need a database program.
(4) You are the best person to write the mission statement and other documents. Try it at your free time.
Man Keung